Cleaning Up the Soap Industry: One Home and Body at a Time feat. Anie Rouleau (The Unscented Company)

Our next guest is exactly what the world needs in a leader: smart, business-savvy, values-driven AND a genuinely lovely human being. On top of it? She is the CEO and Founder of a truly incredible brand, one that I am personally a huge fan of (and have been for years): The Unscented Company. Redefining the notion of clean, The Unscented Company offers a full line of natural home and body care products that are exclusively unscented, efficient, and designed to reduce plastic and water by offering refills and solid options. 

So, who is the joyful disruptor behind this brand? Anie Rouleau.  

A pioneering leader reshaping the future of sustainable business, Anie and the company she founded (The Unscented Company) redefines the notion of clean with innovative, natural home and body care products. With a dedication to sustainability and social impact, Anie champions refillable packaging and waterless products, combating single-use plastics and protecting waterways. An advocate for the B Corp model, she promotes local sourcing, ethical leadership, and equal opportunity employment.

Anie's achievements include appearances on Dragons' Den Canada, Canada's Top Growing Company for four consecutive years, and recognition with the Young Phoenix Prize and the Trudeau Medal. An influential speaker at institutions and organizations such as BDC, C2 Montreal, UQAM, Concordia, McGill, ETS, and the University of Ottawa, she's committed to mentoring young female entrepreneurs. Anie leads a B Corp Certified and Women Owned business, a role she's held since 2011.

Anie is such a remarkable leader, and has the gift of human connection. I have no doubt that her warmth and passion will shine right through the audio waves, so sit back, relax and enjoy our chat with Anie.

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Welcome to The Resilience Report, Anie. I'm so happy to have you on today.

 Oh, it's a pleasure to be here, Lauren. Thank you for inviting me.
 
 So, you're honestly... I told you off air, I woke up, and I was so excited to talk to you this morning. You are honestly such an inspiration for many in the sustainability space. For those who are maybe less familiar with you or with The Unscented Company, can you share a little bit about who you are and how you have found yourself in today's position professionally?

First of all, I grew up in an entrepreneurial family. Both my parents were entrepreneurs, so it's something that I really looked up to because I saw my father building a business, as my mother did. But I saw them also very involved in the community. And for me, the entrepreneur was someone that could build a business, be with his family, so I saw my parents at dinner at night. But also, I saw them organizing the Christmas parade in St. Zénon on the South Shore of Montreal. I did door-to-door to collect some money because my father bought a house for $7,000 to bring in people from Cambodia back in '75 and offer them a place to stay. And for me, I said, "You know what? That's what I want to do when I grow up. I want to be an entrepreneur because I want to be able to build a business and at the same time, make a difference in my community." So, for me, that's where it really all started. 

I found myself at 40 years old, actually 42; the kids were two and three years old. One morning, I woke up and I said, "Okay, if I don't do it now, I won't do it." So, I just launched The Unscented product. I wanted to create a business that would have an impact on the environment and the community. I wanted to design a line of home products, body care products, and hair care products that were healthier, fragrance-free, dye-free, vegan, with natural-based ingredients. But also, at the same time, address another big environmental issue, which is single-use plastic packaging. So, really, at 42, I said, "Okay, that's exactly what I'm going to do. I'm going to launch a natural home and body care products that will be designed to reduce your plastic footprint." It was clear, and I knew I wanted to grow up in that space. It really fulfilled what I'd seen of my father as an entrepreneur. I was able to add to the dimension of the environment. It was good at 42 because I guess I had the experience of working elsewhere and working with my parents, and old enough to know what I wanted. Now it's been 10 years that the business has been open, but only, I would say, 2016, 2017, when I launched The Unscented Company.

That's amazing, the journey of how you've gotten there. You described it as being kind of that natural home and body product line. Can you help explain a little bit more as to where The Unscented Company can be found for maybe those who are less familiar with the brand itself?

Absolutely, yes. The Unscented Company really is in the space of household products and bath and body. We have body care products, hair care products, and we've just launched six months ago the baby products for babies and kids. So, I'm in different categories, which is pretty interesting because I'm sold in conventional supermarkets or the natural space. So, the really independent natural stores in neighborhoods, I'm sold in pharmacies also because of the body and body care products. And you know who's my nicest and biggest customer? It's Canadian Tire, of all retailers in Canada. I really wasn't sure if I wanted to be sold at Canadian Tire, but Greg Hicks, who's the CEO, told me, and I said, "Why?" And he said, "Because you're a woman-owned certified business, natural and biodegradable, eco-friendly products, and locally manufactured. But that's not all the reasons, Anie. My customers go fishing and hunting, and they can't use any fragrance when they wash their hair or body”. So, I'm also available at Canadian Tire and some hardware stores throughout Canada. So, mostly now, I would say 6,000 points of sale in Canada and about a thousand now in the US. So, it's really picking up.

It's incredible to see, and sometimes it's the least places you think that turn out to be the best retailers. So, I really wasn't expecting that, and I almost declined it because I did decline a few customers. Right now, it's not the right timing, like a Home Depot or a Walmart. I wasn't ready for that, and my customer base wasn't ready also. So, Canadian Tire, I was afraid. I said, "Oh my God, can I actually pull that one off?" But Greg Hicks had the right women-owned businesses on the shelf at Canadian Tire. I need to say yes. If not, no one will be there.

That's incredible, and you mentioned at the heart of the development was the idea of reducing single-use packaging. That is certainly where I became first familiar with The Unscented Company – the idea of refilling my soaps at different local stores and that sort of thing. What made you want to start incorporating that into your business model?

It was actually right at the beginning. That was the purpose of the business. That's one way of reducing your plastic footprint – by reusing your bottles and going for a refill in-store or refilling at home. So, it was really part of my business model to always offer not only the starter kits and the starter formats, but always 100% of our product has a refill option or a solid option. So, whether it's your shampoo, you have your shampoo refill or you have your shampoo bar – plastic-free and water-free. That was really to be able to achieve one of my best KPIs: How many bottles of plastic have I saved through the years? Last year, it was 1.2 million bottles because people like you, Lauren, went and refilled and reused their plastic bottles. Because single-use plastic packaging is not just your bottle of water, it's your bottle of shampoo and your laundry bottle also. So, that really was right at the heart of my business model. Although the pandemic hit, and all the refills had a very difficult time. So, all of my little stores with refills didn't have groceries. They really had a rough time. We saw a decline in the stores, but I saw an increase in people on the web buying the refill stations. So, they did in-house refills. My concept really continued growing, and now 50% of my business is refills. So, we're really truly meeting my mission of reducing plastic packaging, and it will always be in my business model. There's one other thing also that I think we need to pay attention to is that when we have those refills, you are also giving the opportunity for stores in the local community to have customers going back to refill. If I became an online business only, we would lose that. And for me, that's important – to continue having my products available in the smaller natural or conventional stores that are very local. And for me, that's important. We need to continue supplying everyone but make sure that the web will always be a maximum of 20% of my business. The rest is brick and mortar. First of all, it diversifies your risk. We've seen it with the pandemic; it can happen again. So, you've got to view first where the customers are, and you've got to also follow your gut feelings of, "Okay, the customer is there. They're not just online. They might do their groceries online, but they're going on Saturday afternoon at brunch." For me, it was important to be everywhere.

It sounds like you've fostered such a deep relationship, obviously, with your customers, but then with your retail partners. How do you choose which retailers to work with? Because it does sound like it's a very conscious part of your decisions along the way.

I don't think I made choices at the beginning. I remember the first customer that said yes because five or even six, seven years ago, if I showed up at a retailer and said, "Listen, I've got a natural-based ingredient product line – home care and body care. It's unscented, and, oh, by the way, I've got refills”, Lauren, I had three strikes. Period. First of all, if it didn't smell like lavender or lemon, it's not clean. So, I had to go against a very deep relationship with fragrances. It's not that I don't like fragrances; I don't think we need it in everything we do in our life and everything we wear. So, the first customers that actually said yes to me were yoga centers. So, I said, "Okay, it's not going to be a retailer. They have a little retailer space at the front of each yoga center." But they used my products as a B2B in the bathroom. And that's how it started because the customers saw the products, reached out, and wanted to have retailers around the yoga center. So, I started going really to look around each yoga studio that I had and just ask that retailer. And then I said, "Oh, listen, I'm at this yoga studio. The customers are requesting it. Can you carry my line?" And they would say, "Yes, absolutely. No problem, but in consignment." I said, "Oh my God, consignment? Okay.” So, I said yes. Today, no more consignment. But that's how I started. Really, the natural was to stick into that natural space with nice zero-waste natural grocery. That really was the first grassroots retailer that I really fostered and made sure I took care of because to reach a Whole Foods, you've got to do your homework with the smaller ones. And after that, you can sign. Now I sign Whole Foods. I just came back from New Jersey this week, where I saw all the New Jersey Whole Foods. And I'm at natural grocers and the bigger chains and the larger retailers. They come in and get you once you're well established in the grassroots community.

That's so neat. And you're mentioning as well that you've had this focus on natural ingredients since the beginning as well. How do you choose which suppliers to work with? And were you impacted at all during some of the supply chain shortages during and since the pandemic?

I am very lucky because I was on the lucky side of the fence during the pandemic. Everyone washed their hands, so I had hand soap. And I came out with a hand sanitizer two, three weeks later – which is another story if we have time. So, I really was on the right side of the fence. The reason why I didn't have any supply chain issues was because one of my B. Corp objectives and one of my business values – I don't know if it's an objective or a business value, I think it's more than an objective – it's really part of my grassroots, is to have a local ecosystem. And 85% of my supply chain is within 500 kilometers of my home, which is downtown Montreal. And that, for me, is non-negotiable. I'm not saying down the road, we might have to go maybe in Ontario and maybe Vermont. I'm not saying that. But when we started, I was able to really pick and choose businesses that were here in Quebec and try to make this business as local as possible. So, when the pandemic hit, I was not waiting on containers on the water. When there was the Vancouver strike at the port, I was not waiting for my containers. So, I realize that right now, with all the turbulence worldwide and the inflation and the cost of shipping on the water is massive, there's so much uncertainty right now, that being local and focusing on that – that was one of my values because I've got kids, and I want them to work in Quebec – turned out to be a good business strategy. It turned out to be that I did not go out of stock, and I was able to supply all of my customers through that year and a half, two years of a once-in-a-lifetime pandemic.

Did you want to touch on the hand sanitizer journey as well?
Just to give a shoutout to my friend Paul Circka, who the next morning, he woke up from the pandemic, he had tots of alcohol because he produces gin and vodka. He's a neighbor of ours. I didn't know him personally, but he called me up and he says, "Listen, my customers are restaurants and events, so I might have to go bankrupt by the end of the day. But I've got alcohol." I called Health Canada, and he said, "I've got a formula. I can produce hand sanitizer." I said, "Give it to me, Paul. Give me the formula. Sell me your totes of alcohol with a good profit to keep your people and the lights open. Let's have our two marketing departments meet to come up with a label, and I will call my customer, which is one of my customers – Lufa Farms – and he will distribute our hand sanitizer." We were sold out in 48 hours. And today, he's selling at the SAQ, and he came out of the pandemic because we did hand sanitizer as a collaboration. And for me, you would have told me three years ago, Lauren, "Yes, you're going to do a collaboration with a gin company." I'd say, "Over my dead body." But no. So these beautiful stories did come out of the pandemic. And today, we can really have a better open mind on who to work with. It doesn't have to be in clothing because I sell laundry detergent. It doesn't have to be, yeah...

So really that happened three weeks within the pandemic, and we just discontinued the hand sanitizer because I'm not a hand sanitizer kind of a person. It's not my favorite product. I think we need to have bacteria on our hands, but for the pandemic, it was essential, and I agree. I did it, but now I discontinued it because I think a good hand wash mechanically 20 seconds will do the job. That's the trick. That's the trick.

Well, that's an incredible story, and it's so nice to see two big Quebec names come together for that kind of opportunity. You did talk about the idea of synthetic perfumes and those being almost directly associated. For the longest time, a fresh scent was lemon or lavender. I can speak from my personal experience that I've gone through a bit of a health journey over the past few years, and I've really discovered a sensitivity I didn't realize was causing issues – synthetic perfume. So, I've been familiar with The Unscented Company for a number of years, but I've gained a deeper level of appreciation as I'm trying to slowly figure out how to wean off of the synthetic perfumes that we're so used to integrating. So, what made you want to do that from the very beginning when clearly it wasn't standard for the rest of the industry?

Yes, no, it's absolutely not a standard, and I was really going against everything. I don't have one person around me who said that would work, that I could not offer just an unscented product, that I would limit my growth, and basically, it wouldn't work. But I am intolerant to fragrances. I did get headaches, massive migraines, and I really started being in an unscented environment since the age of 18, and I discovered that really through a doctor. We were trying everything, and it's not science. I cannot confirm that it is. I just stopped using perfume and synthetic perfume in products, and I did not have a headache after. So, for me, I kind of put one and one together, and I just decided that I would create a line. Oh no, no, no, you know what? There's something else that happened. Yes, I'm intolerant. Yes, I wanted to do that, but I walked into a Whole Foods in Florida, and they had this big metal shelves case shelving, whatever, and they had just written in big letters, "Unscented products," and they had really taken all of the products in their store and put it on that shelf. And I said, "Oh, I am not the only one having issues with scented products." Really, and I was traveling, and the name "The Unscented Company" popped up in my head. First thing I did, trademarked it in Canada, trademarked it in the US. $2,000 later, no business, nothing, no accounting, not one customer, but I had the trademarks, and I said, "Okay, I better do something with that." So, for me, it really was a personal thing, and I could not believe that I was the only one. And today, my customer base or my persona – I don't know how to call them – but whoever buys The Unscented Company is definitely anyone with skin sensitivity or smell sensitivity or asthma or allergy or if they went through any cancer chemo, they had a sensitivity on the skin, any man that lives alone in their apartment that doesn't want to have a floral scent, any pregnant women, any children, and now we've added the man going hunting, fishing, camping, any outdoor, all the cyclists. So, a lot of also in the sport where when they wash their clothes, it really with unscented makes it better. So, I have enough. I don't need to go compete against those big, huge multinationals about fragrances. That's their business. But for me, it was just something I've just been living with an unscented environment even at the office, and it's not obvious to everyone at the beginning when they say, when they are hired or they start joining the company and they have to stop wearing perfume, and they all come back to me said, "My God, this is the best thing”. I don't mind Friday night, Saturday night, you wear it. It doesn't matter. But the all-purpose in your shower and you don't need that. 

Yeah, it's once you start opening your eyes to it. It's remarkable. Why do we put dyes and perfume in laundry detergent? It's really taken me a number of years to figure it out, but thank you for leading the charge. And you mentioned B Corp a couple of times, and this is a term that I think a lot of our listeners are familiar with but maybe don't fully understand, and this is a deep part of what you do, and it sounds like alignment of your business as well. So, could you share a little bit more about what B Corp means?

Absolutely. When I really discovered that also, I was not familiar that this type of certification existed. It was in 2014, and I was in a conference, and that lady Nathalie Voland, who owns real estate in Montreal, had become certified B Corp, and I researched it, and I said, "Oh my God, this is exactly what I need to do." Because I was more […] I grew up in my father's business as ISO. We would really certify the product and the process. B Corp, you certify your values. It's really looking at the business with a three bottom line, so you look at it as a profitable business. You don't have a choice. You need to make money. If not, banks won't like you. But not to the detriment to the people, your employees, your community, and the environment. So, it's really profit, people, planet. And it's a legal process. So really, it's during your status of incorporation. It's really written in the law as a – in your law books. I don't know what it is in English, but so you write down, and you close your status of incorporation. And then you manage your business according to those three bottom lines. So, on the governance, on the employees, on the product, on the community. And that's it. On the product – I think I've said them all, but so really, as you look at all of the values that you have inside your business, and that's what you certify. And you set yourself some goals. And you have to. It's a big assessment. You've got to meet certain criteria. And no one cannot just become B Corp tomorrow morning. You really have to set up a business model based on doing good. Use your business. Their tagline is, "Use your business as a force for good," which really resonates for me. I think we have a voice when you're an entrepreneur. You got to use that force. And you got to use your business also to do things differently and with better KPIs that are not just financial KPIs, but they're KPIs on as much on the level of satisfaction of your employees to the level of your footprint left behind in the environment. So it's a bit tough for me because I'm not an expert on B Corp, but once you get into it, it's like an ISO. It's a process. And you look at every single department. You look at your policies. My purchasing policy – well, my policy is to make sure I buy local first. If it can be a woman-owned business, I would like that also because now I'm only at 12.6% of my supply chain that are owned by women. We have an objective of bringing it up to 25%. So, you have a policy – be local. Second, if it's a woman, even better. Third, what type of ingredients? We send them some questionnaires to look at, okay, where do they stand on, let's say, on JEDI, which is Justice, Equity, Diversity, and Inclusion. And they might not have anything right now. It's okay. It doesn't matter. But at least we're opening the conversation. And for me, that was important to do.

And we do have listeners who are entrepreneurs as well or just even leaders within their organization. If they're interested in becoming B Corp certified, is that – what does that process look like? And is it better, for example – this is a question I received recently – is it better for a startup to get involved, or can a large publicly traded company go towards it? What does that look like?

You know what? It's all of the above. I did it. We had only – I had only one employee and maybe $500,000 in sales, and we had last – oh no, three years ago – Nespresso and Danone who became B Corp certified. So, they're very large companies or startups like mine and everything in between. And I think it's – you've got to have the right mindset, the right management, the right – also objectives from the top people. The top people need to really be on board because it's everyone's business to become a B Corp. It's everyone's job in the business to support the B Corp. Not just one person. Like you don't come in the office and say, "Okay, you're going to be in charge of B Corp. Get us certified." This will never happen. I think it's everyone's business. And you really have to get everyone on board because it's not an easy process. But it really aligns everyone toward the same objectives, the same goals. And it really also gives you all the tools when you hire people that you hire them because they believe in your mission, they believe in your vision, and your values. So really, all of that B Corp will help you. So you can do it at the beginning because for me, it was really setting up a strong foundation. That's why I did it. I really wanted to build my business on a foundation that really recognizes my values to the heart of this business model. And so B Corp was that. You see, and I'm not ISO 9000, whatever it is. I decided just to stay with B Corp. And now being GMP mostly on the process, but B Corp was the first certification I got.

Can you speak to GMP a little bit as well? I know it's a separate conversation there, but would you want to dive into that a little bit further? 

Yes, the GMP, which is the Good Manufacturing Process.

And that really – I'm at the point now, I need to make sure, process my quality have – not more organization, but you need to get to a certain volume. But now, because we're a B Corp, because we have already the policy and a lot of also information, it's much easier to get any other certification. But yeah, by March of next year, we got Woman Owned in 2021, B Corp this year. 2024 is going to be GMP. 

Wonderful. And to go back to what you're doing right now, I know you are so busy. You said you flew in yesterday, you had a photo shoot this morning. Are you working on any maybe one or two projects in particular that you can share that you're really excited about right now?

Oh my God, to be very honest, we launched the baby line this year. So, it was a big year to launch. And right now, I'm really looking at some innovation in 2024 on how to reduce water footprint. So, with our refills, with our solid products, plastic-free, now we need to really do water because 20 years ago, I grew up in businesses where we talked about carbon footprint. It was all about carbon footprint. Now we are addressing plastic footprint. We don't have a choice. Everyone needs to address the packaging. But in 10, 20 years from now – and maybe before, but let's put 15 years – we will be talking about water footprint. We need to reduce water at the source. We need to reduce water when we're in the shower. So, I need to come up with products that are manufactured without water, that don't necessitate water. And ultimately, when you wash your hair, you don't need the water or wash your dishes. You don't need water. So, we need to – and how far am I going to get? I don't know, but we need to talk water footprint. And I think the more we're going to look into that, I have four new products coming out next year with that in mind. What we need to go further. We need to make sure. And at the same time, I want to open in the US. So, I'm traveling in the US trying to get a bit more customers, knocking on doors and saying, "Hi, I'm Annie. I'm the owner of The Unscented Company."

It's so inspiring, and it's so exciting too that you're - in the problem - you're finding all of this innovation too. It's really incredible to see. And that's the whole idea behind The Resilience Report is to see how our entrepreneurs in the space are being creative and coming up with these solutions. I can't wait to see what 2024 is going to look like for you.

Oh, me too. Really, it's going to be a good year, I think. I think for all of those entrepreneurs out there, we need to make sure that we prioritize next year carefully because it's going to be a tougher year, we know that. But knowing that we're going to get ready for it, reprioritize, and usually, it's the right time to work on automation and innovation. Use that time to do that. 

So I am looking forward to it because I know we'll experience a little slowdown, but I know what I'm going to do when it's going to slow down, and I'm anxious to start doing it. 

You mentioned you grew up in an entrepreneurial household, so you can definitely see where that piece came from. From the sustainability side, was there a specific moment where you decided this is going to be part of your future, or has it been more of a gradual process?

No, I would be lying to say I always knew I would end up, maybe not at 42, 43 years old. I maybe would have thought it would have been earlier, but when I worked with my parents, he gave me the opportunity, my father, to go open his business in Birmingham, Alabama. So my, I don't know, I guess my direction was to go there. And after that, at 35, I met my husband, and I had my kids at 39 years old. So I decided to drop everything to stay with the kids and be at least four years with them. And to be an entrepreneur with kids, it's a perfect job because I really was able to start my business but still not miss one nap in the afternoon, not one ballet recital. I felt like I was able to prioritize the kids also. But I always knew I would end up with my business. That's the only thing I know what to do. That's the way I grew up. And at seven years old, my father was explaining what cashflow was all about at the table. So, I knew that early on, and I'm doing the same thing with my own kids. And I'm not too sure if that's good or not, but we don't shy away from business. But they're interested, and I know I've got two little entrepreneurs inside them. 

That's amazing. And did you know for a long time that you wanted to have sustainability as part of that entrepreneurial journey, or has that been kind of a process as well?

Yes, did I think that sustainability would be part of my business model right at the beginning when I started with my father. We were running an assembly plant in Birmingham, Alabama. And right then, he always said to me, "Anie local content is important." And so we would fly in some aluminum all the way from Beauharnois, from Quebec, all the way down to Birmingham so we could have that local aluminum inside our product. So, for him, back then, it was very important that local companies would benefit from our growth. So, for me, I don't know if the environment, plastic was never in the mid, but I knew local manufacturing was definitely part of my, I don't know, the values I grew up with. And it turns out that having a business in soap, because ultimately that's what I do, Lauren, I'm a soap company and a soap company by definition has a lot of plastic. So, I said, you know what? Okay, let's make sure that we address that problem within our company because I'm still producing plastic. I'm still putting single-use plastic packaging in the market. I'm part of the problem. But knowing that we need to address it and we want to be part of the solution. And it's always easier to be part of the solution when you live the problem. So absolutely. 

But that's so neat too that that's the second generation, possibly soon third generation into that space. And what advice would you have for a young woman or even a young version of Anie just starting off in sustainability? What advice would you have for that person?

Oh my God, that, you know what? You can build a business being sustainable and profitable. It really is not a question today. Us women, we have that leadership. We have values inside us that are really, I want to say more feminine and which is okay. I do believe that we have a different outlook on life, a different outlook on, like, really, this common well-being, the empathy. And I think it's our time right now because this is what the world needs. And right now, it's the time to start businesses, and being sustainable and profitable is absolutely possible today. And us, we can do that. Absolutely. And you know what? I just feel also that I didn't try to make something that didn't exist. I didn't try to find the best idea out there. I took something that really is very conventional. I'm selling dish soap, but I'm doing it on my own terms and my own values. And so sometimes, one maybe one thing I would say is that don't search too long. See, it doesn't have to be reinventing the wheel. You can definitely look at something and just do it better.

I love that. I really, really think that's opening future entrepreneurs' eyes too as a different path that is available. And I'm sure it's not always easy, even just being on the road like you were saying can be a little bit busy. Do you have any tools in your toolbox that just help keep you staying motivated and resilient even when it doesn't always feel as easy or as exciting?

Yeah, no, true for sure. There's days that it's tough. When you start, there's always the financing part of the business that's always a bit challenging, and it's challenging at the beginning. It's challenging at the middle. And it's going challenging all the way down the road. But I always come back telling myself, Anie, you're only selling soap. Relax. And it really helps me. There's people out there that are doing stuff much more courageous than I am that have lives of people in their hand. I don't. So really, if my day didn't go the way, I go to bed and “I'm just selling soap, tomorrow's another day”. 

I have a dog, which, and two kids, obviously. But my dog really helps me during the day to get up and go walk with him. And I think that 20 minutes, twice a day, really helps me to just step back a little bit and just tell me, okay, relax, let's take this. I'm not a personality that panics very easily. I pretty much stay calm. But I do have to talk to myself to stay calm, even though that's part of me. And that's how I just, you know, I'm trying to make it also not always something where there's always a solution. There's always something. And maybe, you know what? Now, because now I'm thinking about it, but I learned maybe a bit too late because now I'm 54 years old next week that maybe I would have liked, don't be shy to reach out because we're all there to help. It's unbelievable when I reach out to somebody, I tell them something, there's a solution. And I did not do that enough. I didn't do that growing up. I didn't do it. Now I do it maybe because I feel more secure or more confident. But my God, everyone's there to help you. So that, you know what? I'm not afraid anymore to just reach out and ask.

And what's the best place for our listeners to check out more about the company? Is it the website? Is it social? What would be the best place?

I do handle only my LinkedIn. So no one touches my LinkedIn. But definitely social media. We're not very active on TikTok, but definitely Instagram and Facebook and the website. And like I said at the beginning, say, we're now in-store. So I kind of like the people to go out there in pharmacies and Metro and Sobeys or across Canada and Bulk Barn or Canadian Tire to just make sure that they go and do purchase their products in the store. Keep us all alive. Absolutely. It's such a part of the community doing that. 

So thank you. And we do like to end every episode of The Resilience Report by asking the same question, which is, what do you think it will take for businesses and leaders to be resilient going forward?

I think we had a very big test on resilience right now. I think for entrepreneurs going through the pandemic and after that, us in Quebec, we had a shortage on, on people, employers. We had inflation. We had supply chain issues. We have turbulence / geopolitics turbulence right now. And we're going into a very 2024 that we will need to really make sure that we keep our priorities straight. So I do believe there's a lot of resilience that has been shown by entrepreneurs, and that we're not done. But I do believe by collaborating together will only be the thing that will only be the way out of this. And my little story with Circka was exactly to finish on that note. Sometimes where you least expect it, someone is going to be there to help you out. And you don't have to be resilient alone. We can be all together and make sure that we stick together because we've shown quite a bit. We're the backbone of the economy in most here in Quebec, say, 80% are small, small and medium businesses. We're important to the workforce. We're important to the economy. We need to make sure that we collaborate and we help each other. And I say that to all other women entrepreneurs also where I do believe that when we help each other, it's not just the addition of one plus one makes two, but it makes three. And it does matter.

Well, Annie, thank you so much for joining us. My skin thanks you too. It's been much better since I've switched to all your laundry products and soap. So, thank you very much. I started off by saying you're an inspiration to so many, but I really do mean it. So, thank you very much. 

Thank you, Lauren, for having me. It was a pleasure to be here today with you.